STP $3 - Marketing Your Mental Health Service with Lead Magnets
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[00:00:08] James Marland: Welcome to the Scaling Therapy Practice. This is the show where we encourage you to take intentional steps towards sustainable growth.
[00:00:16] James Marland: My name's James Marland. This we, this week we have, uh, Lisa Mustard and Dawn Gabriel with us. Hello.
[00:00:24] Lisa Mustard: Hi.
[00:00:25] Dawn Gabriel: Hi.
[00:00:26] James Marland: So glad that you're here today to talk about our topic, lead magnets and adding value before the sale. Uh, we're gonna get into our tip of the week, but first, Lisa's gonna tell us all all about lead magnets and what they are.
[00:00:40] Lisa Mustard: Well, this is a really big topic and we could probably, I could probably spend hours talking about lead magnets 'cause it's probably one of my favorite things to help, uh, therapists or clinicians. Kind of wrap their brains around. And so why do we need a lead magnet that this is a question that comes across my dms a bunch? Well, we need a lead magnet because we wanna grow our email list. And the reason we wanna grow our email list is so we can stay connected to our audience and to our customers. Because here is the reality of social media. Social media can go away at any second. We've all experienced an outage. We've all experienced maybe being, who knows, maybe been like,
[00:01:18] James Marland: The algorithm
[00:01:19] Lisa Mustard: algorithm changes
[00:01:20] James Marland: or,
[00:01:21] Lisa Mustard: um, but we own our email list and people who, who, find you on social media, You wanna work to get them on an email list so you can start nurturing that relationship.
[00:01:31] Lisa Mustard: You can start to to work on adding to the know, like, and trust. And I have a ton of lead magnets over the years. I have tried a bunch of different lead magnets. I love lead magnets, I just love creating them. I could probably do it all day long. Um, but I know it's something that we definitely wanna. Talk about is how do you get people to get onto your lead magnet, or how do they even discover your lead magnet?
[00:01:51] Lisa Mustard: So I, I wanna cover that. Maybe that'll come up as we kind of get moving into this. So there are a number of ways to, well, first of all, if you're gonna have an email list, you, you need to pick an email provider and there's lots of freebies out there. Um, I personally have been using AWeber for as long as I can remember.
[00:02:09] Lisa Mustard: Don looks like she's given me the Amen
[00:02:11] James Marland: I've used, I've used AWeber and I do like their service, and their customer service was pretty easy to use
[00:02:18] Lisa Mustard: Yes. And,
[00:02:18] Lisa Mustard: and over the years they have definitely upped their, um, the like newsletter style, the things you can do in their email. I really love it. And um, and then you can always start with them for free. There's other ones out there. I know some people use MailChimp. Um, that's another popular one. Um, so, you know, do your homework and see which one you like the best. Don't spend too much time, you know, don't go into the thousand Facebook groups and ask for why, and blah, blah, blah. Just pick one. Just pick one and go with it. You can always, you can always move later when, because, um, Even if you're not sure what the future holds for you and your personal brand or your business brand, it's still a really good idea to go ahead and start that email list three days ago or three months ago. Um, because it's really important to have one you're gonna wish three years from now that you had started your email list 10 years ago.
[00:03:06] Lisa Mustard: It's just one of those things that once you kind of get going with it and see the power of it, you realize, man, I should have been doing this a long time ago. Alright, so lead magnets, I've heard 'em called a bunch of things over the years. The one I love the most is called the ethical bribe. So, you know, you are asking your potential client or customer to give that, give you their email address and in return you're gonna give them something of value that they really, really want. And that depends on what it is that you do. So I could come up, I mean, give me, tell me what you do right now, Don. What would be, what would be something that you would like to grow an email list on or for?
[00:03:46] Dawn Gabriel: Um, uh, you mean for my personal
[00:03:48] Dawn Gabriel: branding? I, yeah. I, um, soul care and spiritual
[00:03:54] Dawn Gabriel: formation for therapists who want to, um,
[00:03:57] Dawn Gabriel: Yeah.
[00:03:58] Dawn Gabriel: holistically
[00:03:58] Lisa Mustard: Okay. So right off the bat, I have so many ideas for you. You could do like,
[00:04:03] James Marland: Lisa's the
[00:04:04] Lisa Mustard: I am the idea fairy. So you could
[00:04:05] Lisa Mustard: do a number of things depending on probably what you like to do, what you can quickly
[00:04:11] Lisa Mustard: to do, what's gonna take you, something you can turn around pretty quickly. I mean, you could do an ebook, you could do a
[00:04:16] Lisa Mustard: checklist. You could even do, um, um, gosh, you could do like an audio meditation. You could do
[00:04:22] Lisa Mustard: a email challenge. You could do an email series. You could do a quiz. I love a quiz. Quizzes convert really well. I highly recommend that if you're thinking about a lead magnet, look at quizzes. People always wanna know where they fall, and personality
[00:04:34] Lisa Mustard: tests always.
[00:04:36] James Marland: Do, do you have a quiz provider? 'cause there's a ton of there. There seems to be a ton of them with different price points.
[00:04:43] Lisa Mustard: I mean, uh, you know, all transparency aside, I am an affiliate for try, interact or interact quizzes. Um, and they have, they have lots of templates on their site already that you can go and look at, and then you can. You have to purchase like a, a monthly or a yearly subscription, but you then set that up with your email provider.
[00:05:02] Lisa Mustard: So whatever, whatever quiz
[00:05:04] Lisa Mustard: you would come up, come up with, you would then attach it to your email provider and then afterwards you would have like an email welcome sequence that would start to nurture everybody who signed up for your quiz and most of the time for people to get their. Quiz results are gonna have to give you their email.
[00:05:18] Lisa Mustard: I have
[00:05:19] Lisa Mustard: done quizzes in the past, and I'll tell you I don't have one right now, but I have done them in the past and they are the highest conversion rates that I have seen. Everybody wants to know what their personality is when it comes to whatever it it is that you offer. That one is really fun. You know, what's your, um, when I did a couple years ago was what's your active wear personality? 'cause I love active wear and I was, um, Promoting a brand. And so I can't tell you how easily that one converted. Everybody wants to know what their active wear personality is based on the type of activity you do. This is what, you know, what type of active wear you should wear. It's not currently, um, out there, so you can't, you can't see it. Um, I've also done one like, um, What is your additional stream of income personality? Um, I've, I've worked on that one. I haven't released that one yet. Um, so quizzes are great and, um, so Don you could do a number of things. I mean, James, you could do a checklist for what you do. You could do an ebook, you could do even a compilation of, you know, um, for those of us that have been podcasting for a while, you could even do like a playlist of,
[00:06:19] Lisa Mustard: you know, episodes based on topics. You could even just do a playlist based on music that
[00:06:24] James Marland: Yeah.
[00:06:24] Lisa Mustard: You could just pick a playlist for music that you like to work to. I mean, there's so
[00:06:27] Lisa Mustard: many things that you could do.
[00:06:29] Lisa Mustard: Sorry.
[00:06:29] James Marland: you just hit your hundredth episode, right?
[00:06:32] Dawn Gabriel: Yeah.
[00:06:32] James Marland: So you have a lot to draw from. your spiritual formation. And, and I remember one of your episodes had had a, a playlist of things. I think it was when, you know, I don't remember which episode it was. I just remember writing about it, and finding all the links for it.
[00:06:51] Dawn Gabriel: Yeah,
[00:06:52] James Marland: But I, Spotify allows you to create playlists, right? Like they allow you to create links for playlists
[00:06:58] Lisa Mustard: Yeah. I mean,
[00:06:59] Lisa Mustard: yeah, you could do, well, I mean, you could even do, like, if you have a hundred episodes, you can break 'em down into here, you know, five episodes, your top five about, um, you know, what like specific topics around Your niche. And so people don't have to like, scroll all a hundred, they just go straight to the episode that they, that they wanna hear.
[00:07:20] Lisa Mustard: Um, that's an, that's a great, that's a great option. Um, yeah, so I have a couple of, uh, oh, so another lead magnet is you could give a, a discount on your products or services. So if you, one of the ones that, so Lemme back up. When I first started doing the POD courses, I knew that I couldn't just sell on social media all the time.
[00:07:39] Lisa Mustard: Like I knew that would get old, promoting 'em all
[00:07:41] Lisa Mustard: the time on social media. So I knew even before I started, I needed to grow an email list. So I worked with my web developer. And he is like, why don't you give away your first one for free? Every who doesn't want free continuing education? I got so many signs up, signups.
[00:07:55] Lisa Mustard: Eventually I moved to half off your first continuing education, uh, pod course. And so that's now growing my lead magnet for people who are interested and can. Continuing education. I have another lead magnet that's 50 ideas for therapists to create additional streams of income. So it's 50 ideas. It's just like checklist, and that was the one that I said to you was when you sign up for that one, eventually one of my emails in the sequence is all about lead magnets. Um, another thing that I've done for lead magnet, which I really love, and if you have some time and a little bit of money to put into this, is actually doing a private podcast feed. So you could create, um, or another, another lead, like I have so many ideas. Another lead is actually doing a limited series podcast. Uh,
[00:08:41] James Marland: For newsletter subscribers
[00:08:43] Lisa Mustard: You could do it for that
[00:08:44] Lisa Mustard: or
[00:08:45] Lisa Mustard: yeah. So like, if you sign up for my newsletter, you're gonna get five, you know, five episodes all on X, y, and Z. That only, you only get when
[00:08:53] James Marland: only for newsletter subscriptions? Yeah.
[00:08:56] Lisa Mustard: So, um,
[00:08:57] Dawn Gabriel: Wow. How do you do that? Oh, that's another question. But anyway, I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm writing so many things down
[00:09:04] Dawn Gabriel: right
[00:09:04] James Marland: Well, it would be a ta. If you use AWeber like we talked about, it would be a tag. You know, if people sign up through this form, they get this tag, which you subscribe them to your nurture sequence and your, uh, You know, the other, the other sequence. So it could be like that or in your, in the email with the tag.
[00:09:26] James Marland: It can send them to a landing page that has all the links to the episodes or the links to the, the content that you want. So it's not, it sounds like, oh, how do I do that? But it's really just directing people in links and that's why you need the email provider doing this inside your own. Gmail account would be murderous
[00:09:46] James Marland: It would be a nightmare
[00:09:48] Lisa Mustard: it would.
[00:09:48] James Marland: to organize and segment all the people who come through you because the, you can, you can tag which people come through, which lead magnet, and then that allows you to segment your audience, oh, this person came through my therapy practice webpage, so they might be more interested in this.
[00:10:06] James Marland: Oh, this person came through my, my product or my service. So they might be interested in more products or services, uh, that, that I have. So you would send the right email to the right people?
[00:10:22] Lisa Mustard: Yeah. And there's also, uh, services out there where you can create a private podcast feed, like, um, I'm using Hello Audio. You can use them. You can also use Sub Stack if you're familiar with Sub Stack. I believe there's a way that you can create like an audio link through there and people have to sign up for that.
[00:10:37] Lisa Mustard: So I think Sub Stack's really cool. Um, I get a, I sub, um, subscribe to a lot of newsletters on sub sub stack and I think it's really neat. Um, .Yeah. So I know that James and I were chatting earlier about, you know, we can have all these ideas, we can come up with like the best lead magnet, but the problem can often be how do you get people to even know that you have a lead magnet? Well, That is the million dollar question because traffic is everything, right? If we don't have traffic, then we don't have an email list. Um, so that's something that, you know, you, when you think about how do you grow your email list, um, That's, that's the million dollar question. Like how do you get the traffic? So, uh, I like Pinterest to grow my, um, email list. Pinterest, I know given me that look like what? So here's the
[00:11:27] Lisa Mustard: cool
[00:11:27] Dawn Gabriel: my gosh.
[00:11:28] Lisa Mustard: I know this is why you wanna use Pinterest, because Pinterest is like Google in the sense of people get on Pinterest to solve problems, they type in how to
[00:11:38] Lisa Mustard: questions. Mm-hmm. So instead of thinking
[00:11:40] Lisa Mustard: about it as like a social media, Product. It's actually a search engine, right? And so once you start kind of thinking, 'cause think about last time you got on Pinterest, James said he was looking at it for like ideas.
[00:11:51] James Marland: Basement ideas.
[00:11:52] Lisa Mustard: Mm-hmm.
[00:11:54] James Marland: What, what, what trim do you use? How do you, uh, we had to put up doors for the laundry room. So what type of doors would work? Paint colors, decorations, like there's no windows. So what, how do you make it look homey lighting? Anyways, all sorts of questions about like basements and, uh, I had a board and I just collected pins and threw, just threw things on there and Pinterest said, oh, you might be remodeling.
[00:12:21] James Marland: Here are 10 other ideas for you. So it was, it was infectious. Uh,
[00:12:27] Lisa Mustard: I love Pinterest, and I would rather put a little bit of money behind Pinterest ads than I would Facebook or Instagram. Um, and that's really in the past how, because Pinterest will work, it just, sometimes it takes a little bit of time for the algorithm to pick up on your pins and to get the, you know, get the traffic in front of you.
[00:12:44] Lisa Mustard: But if you're willing to put a little bit of money and to Pinterest ads, um, you can grow your, your email list pretty, pretty quickly now, I mean, That all depends on your lead magnet and then, you know, um, what, what your, what you're giving them in return. But I, I have seen some pretty quick growth with using
[00:13:04] James Marland: So the pin would take them to your webpage, which asks them, if you want this download, sign up. Is that how that process
[00:13:12] Lisa Mustard: Yeah. So I mean, you can do it like that. You can send it to a landing page or you can send it to like a blog post or you have it, you know,
[00:13:18] Lisa Mustard: in the blog post.
[00:13:19] James Marland: Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm.
[00:13:20] Lisa Mustard: so there's lots of different ways that you can, that you can do it on, on Pinterest, you know, definitely have it in Instagram and definitely have it on Facebook.
[00:13:27] Lisa Mustard: You know, if you're in the bus bajillion Facebook groups for therapists, you know, we're always like, You know, marketing Mondays are the
[00:13:35] James Marland: Mm-hmm.
[00:13:35] Lisa Mustard: say, I have a, you know, a checklist for getting your private practice started. Um, you know, how many of those have I downloaded over the past, well, not 15 past, like couple of years of a bunch. Um, I think honestly one of the best lead magnets that we have is our podcast. And so
[00:13:53] Lisa Mustard: I have seen really great growth from my lead magnets through my podcast, um, and. It's just the more you promote your podcast, make sure your lead magnet is on each of your episodes where they can, like, if you go to my website and you wanna listen to an episode, I'm always pointing people to my website. I'm always wanting them to go listen to my podcast on my website. Not on, I mean, yeah, I, if you, if all you can do is get to Apple and get on Apple Podcasts, great. But if I'm gonna put a link anywhere, it's gonna be to my site because I'm always gonna
[00:14:23] Lisa Mustard: have in my show notes, I'm gonna have that lead magnet. Right there. And if they're
[00:14:27] Lisa Mustard: on my website and they go to pod, like they're just gonna click around, right? And so maybe they'll hit my pod course page and they'll, the popup will show up and it says, get 50% off your first pod course. And then they'll see my other stuff too, if they go to my resources page, you know, so they'll see you want people on your website.
[00:14:44] Lisa Mustard: And so I highly recommend having some type of popup or form write. I mean, Don, I know you put your, um, your therapist matrix in the middle of your website and it's awesome. I just, when people were asking me about it, I just said, here's the website. Just scroll down, you'll see it.
[00:15:01] Lisa Mustard: So I hope that that was, you know, bringing you people.
[00:15:03] Lisa Mustard: But um, yeah, I mean, it's having something of value that your audience is dying to have. And it doesn't have to be anything. I mean, you know, just, and I joke around and say, how many private prac practice checklists do I have? You know, people still want to collect all the checklists. And then once you have them on your email list, that's where you nurture their relationship to.
[00:15:23] Lisa Mustard: Then maybe they'll wanna book a call with you or by your course, or even ask you questions, you know? Um, but you have to, you have to work. You have to work for the rights or to, um, to be in somebody's email. I feel like that's a, a. It's a wonderful privilege that they're giving us is to continue to email. Um, and another thing about those email providers, you can see your stats. So you can see how many people open your email and you can see how many people click on your link. Um, all that stuff. So
[00:15:50] James Marland: So you're, you're saying you're not just hammering people with buy, buy now email marketing messages in your email, and you're just like, no, once you got 'em, you don't just, you know, try to, try to get 'em to buy something right away. What do you do?
[00:16:03] Lisa Mustard: oh,
[00:16:03] James Marland: how you, you've, you're like, you nurture them. I know if I'm being facetious, but, uh, so what do you include in the email to, uh, nurture people?
[00:16:11] Lisa Mustard: You know, I feel like that's so, um, specific to the, to the person writing the email and to the relationship that they are trying to build with their audience. Because you might send that first one or two emails and it, and you might get some unsubscribes, but that's okay. People are gonna fall off your list. That's all right. They're not your people, so don't, don't have a, don't be so upset if people unsubscribe. I have people unsubscribe for my list all the time. It's like,
[00:16:34] Lisa Mustard: I'm not for them. That's fine. You know, I don't want you to hate me. I want you to be able to get away from me if you, if you don't like my emails, like hit unsubscribe.
[00:16:41] Lisa Mustard: We don't want you upset with me. Um, And I've had people write me back and, and they love what I do, so you're gonna, you, what do they say? You can't be, um, you can't, you're not everybody's cup of tea,
[00:16:51] Lisa Mustard: you know? So
[00:16:52] Lisa Mustard: you have to just be true to your voice. And, you know, the whole thing about email marketing, and we could probably do a whole other episode on that. Um, you know, I try to email once a week to my list. Some people do once a month. Um, some people do three times a week. It really just depends on I don't always, you know, in my, in my emails, I usually say like, this is new on the podcast, um, you know, new, new pod courses out or just, you know, Hey, I found this free resource. I thought of you. Maybe you guys would want this. Or, here's a free training from somebody that I'm not even connected to you, but I know everybody needs ethics. So, hey, here's a free, here's a free ethics course. Um, it really, you know, just, I don't, I, I think you just have to find your voice in, in email and, um, Be open to trying new things and pivoting when you, you need to,
[00:17:43] Lisa Mustard: yeah.
[00:17:45] James Marland: So you said I have three questions on, uh, Lead magnets. Before we get into that, did you have a tool or tip for us, Lisa,
[00:17:55] Lisa Mustard: Well, I feel like I've mentioned so many
[00:17:57] Lisa Mustard: already,
[00:17:57] James Marland: was your tool and tip. Okay.
[00:17:59] Lisa Mustard: I dunno. I mean tool, like I said, if you wanna do a quiz, there's lots of them out there.
[00:18:02] Lisa Mustard: There's, I
[00:18:03] James Marland: let's,
[00:18:03] Lisa Mustard: try. Interact is good.
[00:18:05] Lisa Mustard: So go over there, you can see temp. They already have templates on there, so you can just click around and, and look at what they've already, they already have quizzes on there that you can take as like a potential customer and just
[00:18:15] Lisa Mustard: decide like if self-help is one of 'em, you know, health and nutrition, psychology, like they have a bunch of different, uh, topics so you can, or you can create your own. Um, so that one I love AWeber, like I said, for email. And Canva is always great to create your lead magnet. Um, That's always, always an easy thing to use. I mean, easy.
[00:18:37] James Marland: we'll type in worksheet and your topic and they'll give you something similar. It's crazy how, how. You can just put that in and then put in your own checklist and you're done. So it's pretty awesome. All right, so let's ask some questions about lead magnets. Uh, and we probably covered this a little bit, but, um, why should somebody even have a lead magnet?
[00:19:03] James Marland: Why do you wanna have a lead magnet and add value before the sale? W why should somebody do that?
[00:19:08] Lisa Mustard: Because it's, it's way more people wanna know. They wanna buy from people they know, like, and trust,
[00:19:15] Lisa Mustard: you know? So, um, think about who you feel like, you know, like, and trust and who you buy things from, you know, so, It's like the podcast. Like I couldn't, I had to, you know, with my podcast, it's like I had to have a certain amount of episodes going before people would probably go, okay, I'll give her my email.
[00:19:34] Lisa Mustard: You know, she seems like she's giving value. She's, she seems like I could list, you know, I like what she has to say. She brings on interesting people. Um, so. Or, I mean, you can try to just sell, sell, sell. But um, like I said, it's hard to just sell from social media because the algorithms don't, they don't favor it. I mean, you could definitely put ads up, um, that's gonna cost you some money. Facebook and Instagram, it, you know, if you're selling something you, they like, they don't wanna just give you. They know what they have. They know that the, the platform that they have is, um, very valuable. So you're gonna have to pay to, if you have a business, um, a business page, it's your stuff can get buried a little bit more. Um, but, so if you can boost a post or you can, um, you know, run an ad, you wanna run it to, I think to your lead magnet. 'cause you wanna get people on your email list. Did I answer your question?
[00:20:28] James Marland: Yeah. What? What would you say Don is a reason for using this?
[00:20:33] Dawn Gabriel: Yeah. I would say, I kind of wanna break it down a little deeper. The know, like, and trust, I mean it I think when I first was learning this whole lead magnet thing, I, I was learning from consultants who had like 10,000, 20,000, like on their email list, and it was so overwhelming that I was like, I just got stuck and I was trying to do this lead magnet and it took me like hours and days and turned into months and I was trying to perfect this one thing
[00:21:02] Dawn Gabriel: and finally and finally it was like, first. First of all, like you already have a few followers. Ask them what they want, what they need, and, and kind of like a deeper level of them knowing and trusting you is you're creating something for them.
[00:21:18] Dawn Gabriel: And it doesn't have to be amazing, but it is like what your audience needs. And so even if you have 10, find out what those 10 are doing and wanting and focus on the 10.
[00:21:30] Dawn Gabriel: Don't focus on 10,000. Just focus on the 10 and keep creating content for that person, or that 10 or that 20. And so I feel like that those lead magnets will create more value and they'll share it with people. And there's so many people out there, there's so many consultants, there's so many. Whatever you do, there's 10 more of you or thir 50 more of you.
[00:21:52] Dawn Gabriel: And so it's like you have to stand out. So creating something that is practical and they also like you, it's gonna be a winning combination.
[00:22:02] James Marland: That's fantastic. Uh, I do, I do think, um, we could get caught into the overwhelm,
[00:22:08] Dawn Gabriel: Yeah.
[00:22:08] James Marland: oh, I gotta make it perfect for like this giant audience, but you're really just creating for the people who connect with you. And if you already have 10 people, those are your people. You know, they've stayed with you and stuck with you.
[00:22:21] James Marland: I really like that idea and just the simple. Simple. The simple thing. Oh, just ask them , you know, what do you need? Uh, getting customer feedback and like your dream client feedback is, is invaluable. Uh, I wanted to talk about the, the chain of, uh, value somebody put into me before I bought into their consulting program, and it wasn't cheap.
[00:22:47] James Marland: Uh, but they, I've discovered them on a free webinar. Then they got, I got on their email list. Then they gave me another free webinar and some handouts and then some more email, and then some time passed and I took the same webinar again, and more email. And then I decided, you know what? I've been listening to this guy for six months to eight months or something.
[00:23:11] James Marland: I really like it. I connect with it. I think I could, I need. He's selling me, um, on this selling me. He's convincing me that he has what I need with all this great free content. Oh yeah. He also invited me to a Facebook group and they had like weekly videos and things. All this work, all this free content.
[00:23:32] James Marland: Then, then I bought his 3005, I don't know what it was, $3,000 program, which I still use some of the concepts today. It was called Atlas, uh, heart-Centered Marketing, and it was great. Uh, he's a Kajabi. He, I, I found him on Kajabi. He's just, he just goes into the Kajabi, well, I think he's, um, hired by them now, but he goes into the Kajabi.
[00:23:57] James Marland: Facebook groups and just gives his advice, not trying to sell you things, just trying to connect with the people who he connects with. And over time, and he, and he respected the time. Uh, I was like, yeah, I need this. I, I gotta have more of what this is and I'm willing to invest time and money and energy into that product.
[00:24:16] James Marland: And I felt like that was such a great way to, to sell. Like he was doing all this pre-selling, you know, pre, pre-con convincing that he is somebody to know, like, and trust. And his, his name's Joey and I can't say his last name 'cause I'm really like, I, I failed phonics, so
[00:24:35] Lisa Mustard: Oh, no.
[00:24:36] James Marland: I think it's Ragona. Sorry Joey if you listen to this, but, uh, yeah, it was, it was great.
[00:24:42] James Marland: Have you had experiences like that?
[00:24:45] Lisa Mustard: Yeah, I
[00:24:46] Lisa Mustard: have. Mm-hmm. definitely.
[00:24:49] Dawn Gabriel: Well, I think, I think the thing that you pointed out, That I wanna reflect back to you, James, is that you said it took six to eight months.
[00:24:56] Dawn Gabriel: So I think for people doing a lead magnet, they need to realize it's not, sometimes it will be overnight if it's a
[00:25:03] Dawn Gabriel: quiz, but sometimes it's that six to eight months.
[00:25:05] Dawn Gabriel: But then they are your definite ideal audience because they have trusted
[00:25:09] Dawn Gabriel: you and it took that long to build. And I feel like in this type of audience and market like you have to. Show that you're gonna
[00:25:18] Dawn Gabriel: last and not burn out and that you're the real deal. And so yeah, it's okay. Just keep going and don't get discouraged, Keep doing it and people will start to trust you more.
[00:25:30] James Marland: Cool. So we've, we've heard a little bit about Lisa, how she uses her lead magnets. Uh, Dawn, she mentioned your lead magnet. How do you use lead magnets in your practice?
[00:25:40] Dawn Gabriel: Yeah, so it's a little bit new to me. Honestly. I feel like I was so overwhelmed when I was starting that I. Focus more on social media and I mean, I had the podcast, I had so much going that now that I've really honed in, I actually enjoy it because it's, my lead magnet is, well, one of 'em is, um, the therapist matrix assessment tool where people can, um, kind of holistically look at their life as a therapist and all the layers that it goes into and they can take an assessment and, um,
[00:26:12] James Marland: People love assessments.
[00:26:13] Dawn Gabriel: I know and rate where they feel like they are. And then my email, like a, my newsletter and email list kind of follows that and helps them go even deeper. Um, so that's how I use it. But I get a lot of feedback from that, and I'm watching my AWeber stats and I'm like, oh, wow. 60% opened it.
[00:26:32] Dawn Gabriel: That's cool. Like And I'm like, so I can tell if they like it or not and which ones they don't like And so that's one way, another way. Um, I love doing free webinars, especially for group practice owners on just developing team culture. So I've done a couple webinars that are free and that's how I've built my email list. Um, and I feel like that's a lead magnet, even though you can do it live, but then that you can also, um, Have it on your website and that people can sign up for it and you get their email that way for later. And I also double it as a podcast episode. Use it
[00:27:12] James Marland: well, episode six is gonna, in season two is gonna be on webinars. So
[00:27:16] Dawn Gabriel: right?
[00:27:16] James Marland: we'll get, uh, get into that and, and how that can drive some traffic. And also with like, Well, I'm getting into the weeds, but joint ventures, like if you partner with people, uh, they can promote you, you can promote them. Uh, it's, it's webinars are a great lead magnet.
[00:27:34] James Marland: It's, it's broken out. 'cause they're, they're a little more technical than just sending a worksheet to somebody. But, uh, you do them well, you know, I did one with David Hall and I got 200. People on my email list. So just from the webinar, he has a bigger list. That's why joint joint ventures are important.
[00:27:53] James Marland: Um, how I use, how I use lead magnets. So I think my biggest one, of course, is the podcast. I think that's been growing steadily. It didn't start out, you know, I got like 10 people in the beginning or something. But it's, it's, it's steadily grown, um, to where there's, there's, uh, . More downloads every, every month.
[00:28:14] James Marland: So that's good to show. See, uh, I do have the, uh, how to validate your course topic, which I'm probably gonna have to do some more research on that 'cause it doesn't seem to be generating the traffic. I would like it to, uh, even though when I was like doing research on how I wanted to create courses, I was like, oh man, I don't wanna invest time into things if I know if it's not gonna make money.
[00:28:37] James Marland: So I was like, ah, how do you do that? And so then I made the worksheet on it. But, um, to me that was a big question. Uh, but it's, uh, it, it hasn't been quite the, uh, the barn burner. I don't know. Like, it doesn't, it hasn't been beating a path of traffic to the door, like the, the, uh, podcast has been doing better.
[00:28:58] James Marland: And I do have a quiz, uh, it's at the end of the episode now where, um, David talks about the builder type assessment. So that's gotten a few people, but it, it also didn't, um, like we spent time in the quiz and he spent a lot of time on it. We identify, identified your builder types, and then we had, if you came out with like somebody who wants to build systems or somebody who wants to like grow group practices, you had a different outcome.
[00:29:24] James Marland: We had resources for the different outcomes. . Um, but maybe I just didn't promote it like I promoted on the podcast, but maybe I didn't talk about it during the show enough to get people to sign up for, for that. So that was, that's where I'm at with the lead magnets. Um, I've been doing, uh, just, I do try to do, uh, interview people on the podcasts that are, Um, interesting.
[00:29:50] James Marland: And that, uh, help, help, help the listeners. And I have been sending out an email, you know, to the email list about the podcast and other resources that people can get. So that's also been useful. So that's how I've been using, um, podcast, uh, lead Magnets.
[00:30:08] Lisa Mustard: Yeah, I wonder if you need to rename that quiz.
[00:30:12] Lisa Mustard: 'cause it doesn't, like, I, I hear that and I'm like, I don't know if that's for me. You know, like what, I guess I'm like, what? What's the end result that, that it's gonna give
[00:30:23] Lisa Mustard: somebody, you know, I don't know, just kind of thinking
[00:30:27] James Marland: No, that's good. That's a good, that's a good, the builder type assessment, like what if, if it's supposed to give you tools and resources to help you scale your, your therapy practice based on your, your, your, your.
[00:30:42] Lisa Mustard: Mm-hmm.
[00:30:43] James Marland: Acc you know, what you're interested in or what you're good at then. Um, 'cause 'cause the idea for some of this podcast was you don't have to be good at everything.
[00:30:53] James Marland: You know, you don't have to grow your practice the way somebody else grows the practice. You have a way of growing your own practice. And that might be systems, it might be people, it might be products, it might be networking, but everybody has their own system. We thought it was, uh, a great way to . To communicate it, but it might not have come across
[00:31:14] Lisa Mustard: I, I think if you put the, per the word personality in there, you'd get
[00:31:17] Lisa Mustard: more takers because it does sound
[00:31:19] James Marland: build a
[00:31:19] Lisa Mustard: Yeah. Like it, well, even like what type of therapy practice owner are you, like your therapy practice personality or something? I'm just trying to get,
[00:31:28] James Marland: Hmm.
[00:31:28] Lisa Mustard: I think, I don't know. I'd be more likely to
[00:31:31] James Marland: No, that's good.
[00:31:31] Lisa Mustard: than I would the builder.
[00:31:32] Lisa Mustard: 'cause I don't know what builder, like what, what does that mean?
[00:31:35] Lisa Mustard: You know?
[00:31:36] James Marland: and maybe getting feedback before spending eight months into it would be beneficial to , to attracting more people.
[00:31:46] Lisa Mustard: see, I think we have to all learn from that because
[00:31:48] Lisa Mustard: I have, I have gone down that path too, where I thought
[00:31:50] Lisa Mustard: this was it. This is gonna, and then it just doesn't, and that's okay. We have to pivot. Like we
[00:31:55] Lisa Mustard: just have to not be emotionally attached to
[00:31:57] James Marland: Mm-hmm.
[00:31:58] Lisa Mustard: throw our hands up in the air and say, oh, I can't do this.
[00:32:00] Lisa Mustard: It's not working. It's like, okay, that didn't work, but What else might work? You know, it's not giving up and you know, oh, I've tried everything. No you haven't. You tried one lead magnet and you tried maybe one social media channel, and you have to look at all the pieces.
[00:32:16] James Marland: It is so
[00:32:16] Lisa Mustard: know, but I've been there and I so get it.
[00:32:18] Lisa Mustard: I'm, that's why I'm, I'm like, I'm, I am just like, you guys gotta use Pinterest. Because Pinterest is where people
[00:32:25] Lisa Mustard: are looking for solutions to their problems, like Google. So if you're not using Pinterest, then you should be using Google Ads. And let me tell you, Pinterest ads are a lot.
[00:32:33] Lisa Mustard: I think this is just from what I've learned over the years, um, You just can't get everybody on social media because your algorithm, they, it stinks. You know?
[00:32:43] Lisa Mustard: So, and if you can, that's why you wanna get 'em on your email list so then you can. Nurture the know, like, and trust. And you can, you can build relationships. And let me tell you, I have people now on my email list I didn't know from Adam or Eve and they are now friends. It's so cool. Like I put a lead magnet on Pinterest and I, I opened it up international.
[00:33:02] Lisa Mustard: 'cause what I was doing was like any, any therapist all over the world, as long as you speak English, we could probably, you know, have something in common here. And I have just connected with some of the most lovely therapists all over the world. And.
[00:33:15] Lisa Mustard: It's just been, it's been heartwarming and it's been like reaffirming, like, yes, you know, people are looking for this information all over the world.
[00:33:24] Lisa Mustard: So, I don't know. I'm just, I'm a big believer in Pinterest and, um, and if, if you can afford Google ads, then, then that would be my second, my second option
[00:33:35] Lisa Mustard: idea.
[00:33:36] James Marland: all right, so those are two tips from Lisa. Dawn, do you have any tips before we we do our takeaways?
[00:33:44] Dawn Gabriel: Mine are. As practical as Lisa's, I think, 'cause I'm still newer to this, but I think I just wanna mention, you wanna repel as much as you wanna attract. And so I think taking the personal, like Lisa said, take the personal attachment to everything away. Just let it go. It's like throw spaghetti at the wall and see what fits.
[00:34:05] Dawn Gabriel: And because you're still building, but once you have like Thousands of followers, then you can ask them. But right now you're just trying what works? Okay, this one didn't work either shift it. How do I shift it? Okay, what do I need to do? And just know that some people are gonna repel, but others are gonna attract and both are okay.
[00:34:22] Dawn Gabriel: And you want that to get your ideal client. Um, it, it's okay. So just hang in there and
[00:34:30] Dawn Gabriel: don't give up.
[00:34:32] James Marland: Okay. Uh, my tip would be, uh, have a, have a, uh, like mention it. Well, this is almost like the takeaway, but mention it as often as possible, like on your blog posts, in your interviews. In your podcast, on your YouTube page, on your Pinterest page, that you're gonna start tomorrow,
[00:34:52] Dawn Gabriel: Basically, yeah.
[00:34:53] James Marland: Like, it's gotta be. It's, it's gotta be everywhere.
[00:34:57] James Marland: Um, and I, uh, one of one, um, uh, I think it was clear brand. I. That's a, that's a place that does, uh, like webpages. I really, I signed up for their email and I get their email and their podcast all the time. But Clear Brandand is like, if you're gonna offer something on your webpage, make sure it looks the same all the way through your webpage.
[00:35:16] James Marland: So the button needs to be, you know, my download at the top of the page, my download in the middle of the page, and my . My free download at the bottom of the page so that people see it over and over again and they don't, their brain isn't like, what is this? What is this? Oh, it's my download. It's my free download.
[00:35:34] James Marland: It's, it's my lead, it's my value. I can get this. And the person who gets to the end of the page, and they see it five times on your page at the end. Uh, they're more likely to click it if it looks the same. This, their, this is their research, not mine, but they're more likely to click it than if, uh, you had it like said five different ways.
[00:35:54] James Marland: They don't know what it is. So that's my tip. All right. We're gonna close out the episode with one takeaway. So we'll start with Lisa. If people could remember one thing, what's their one takeaway for the show?
[00:36:06] Lisa Mustard: Create your lead magnet so you can start your email list. one, take away. Do it.
[00:36:14] James Marland: All right. Just do it. All right. And Dawn, your takeaway.
[00:36:19] Dawn Gabriel: you can have more than one
[00:36:21] Dawn Gabriel: lead magnet. Have multiple, and don't get too attached to
[00:36:24] Lisa Mustard: There you go. I like it.
[00:36:25] James Marland: great tip. And mine is, uh, restating what Lisa said. Get started . Just, just do it. You don't have to wait for the perfection. That is my, that is my problem. I wait for perfection, Dawn says, and Lisa. Okay. So we all have the same problem. Where we want the perfect, and then it takes weeks and months to get it done.
[00:36:43] James Marland: We're we're experimenting. You're experimenting with what works, and you don't know if it works until you get it out there. So start getting things out there. All right. That's gonna wrap it up for this episode of the Scaling Therapy Practice. Please take those intentional steps towards . Sustainable growth and we'll see you next time.
[00:38:04] James Marland: Thank you for listening to the scaling therapy practice I hope you enjoyed the show I want to remind you that the content shared today is for general information and entertainment purposes only It shouldn't be considered as legal or tax advice If you need a professional advice in those areas please consult with a licensed attorney or accountant but thank you so much for listening The scaling therapy practice is part of the psych craft network
